President Lula's press conference during visit to Ethiopia

To me, this has been one of my most important trips, ever—and certainly, of all the meetings I will have, this is an extremely important one, because I was able to speak to almost all African countries at once. If I had to visit each country, it would be 54 trips—and this would be impossible to do until the end of my term.

And to me, speaking to the presidents of African countries is always a source of great pride. Firstly, because I am aware—and I would like Brazil to be aware—that we have to have a preferential relationship with Africa. Not only because Africa is part of our history, our culture, our way of being, our way of speaking, our way of singing, our color, but also because Africa is an extraordinary place for the future to those who believe that the Global South will be the novelty of the 21st century in the new world economy.

When we talk about climate and energy transmission, and low-carbon agriculture, we look at the world map and we see two extraordinary places: one is in Latin America, within the map of Brazil, and the other is in Africa, where there is an exuberant amount of millions of hectares of land to be explored so that we can carry out the healthy agriculture that the world needs, the low carbon agriculture that the planet needs, and also the possibility of making African countries, which for a long time were exploited...

I said today in the meeting with an African president that, since the Berlin Conference of 1884, when Africa was divided between the countries of the old continent, England, France, Germany above all, this continent was self-sufficient in producing its own food. After colonization, these countries, many of them, stopped being self-sufficient, and today they depend on food that comes from the colonizing countries, and there is no explanation for this.

So, we are coming to Africa to tell our fellow Africans that Brazil doesn't have everything but, the little that Brazil has we want to share with Africa. We want to return to them, in the form of benefits, possibilities and development, what they gave us as a workforce for 350 years; it is a commitment of faith.

It's a commitment that we have to make more and more, because I think that, for a growing country like Brazil, a country with extraordinary possibilities such as Brazil, we just have to look at our trade with the so-called rich world, so we can understand that, with most of the countries considered rich in Europe, our bilateral trade, the flow does not exceed 8 or 9 million dollars. And with developing countries, our trade is much greater (and the possibilities are enormous). And that's why I'm very grateful to be alive, to have been elected president to return to the African continent and say: “we're going to start working on the policy of integration between Brazil and the African continent.”

For centuries, we looked at the map of the United States, we looked at the map of Europe and we saw neither South America behind us nor the African continent in front of us. It was as if poor people didn't interest us. And as I am convinced that the poor are the solution of the contemporary world: just give them the opportunity they need and we will realize the middle class society that we can create on this planet.

A society without war, a society without banalism, a society without fake news, a society without xenophobia, a society without any type of prejudice, in which we are all treated on equal terms.

Well, that world has yet to be built, and I think Africa is an extraordinary place for that.

So, an extremely important thing is that there is no explanation for a country the size of Brazil—we already had a trade flow with Nigeria of 10 billion dollars; today this flow is only 1 billion and 700 million dollars. There is no explanation, a country of 200 million inhabitants like Brazil has relations with Ethiopia of 126 million, and we only have 23 million dollars in trade flow. Even with Egypt, which is our biggest trade balance in Africa, it's 2 billion and 800 million dollars, it's very little. For a country that wants to have a voice in the world, for some countries that want to improve the level of quality for their children, it is very little.

So I'm going to go back to telling Brazilian comrades who work in Brazilian embassies, to our comrades who work in the area of ​​commerce, that we need to go back to being peddlers, travel the world, talk to all the necessary people so that we can sell what Brazil is capable of producing—and so that we can buy what other countries need to sell to Brazil and that Brazil needs.

This is the world we need to create, which I call the Global South. It is this new world that is in front of us, in front of our eyes. There is no explanation for why we don't have this in mind, so we can make the necessary investments.

The issue of energy transition passes through Brazil and through Africa. The issue of low-carbon food production affects Brazil, Latin America and Africa. So we have to take advantage of this so that we can make the 21st century better for us than the 20th century was. So the trip, for me, is very pleasurable; it was very pleasurable because we were able to see the pleasure and joy that people have in seeing Brazil return to African soil.

It made it seem like Brazil had disappeared and Brazil came back, not just because of samba, not just because of Carnival—Brazil came back because of politics. Because now Brazil has a government that has, you know, a privileged relationship with Africa. Not only because Brazil needs it economically, but because Brazil has historical debts to pay with solidarity and the transfer of knowledge, especially in the field of ​​agriculture. Therefore, I leave here satisfied.

Obviously, it’s another Sunday without seeing Corinthians play; I don't even know if they'll win or lose because the game is against Palmeiras today. But anyway, after a long, dark winter of losing so many games in a row, we've now won two games in a row. I return to Brazil hoping that, when I land at the airport, Corinthians will have won the game. And I can be even happier.

Also, if you want to ask a question or two about my trip. If you want to ask about Brazil, I would like to advise you to ask when we return to Brazil. If you're going to ask about Africa, ask whatever you want, if not, it's not worth traveling. We traveled to discuss Africa and you ask about São Bernardo do Campo…

Question from a journalist — Carien du Plessis, from The Africa Report (in English)

President Lula — People often think I'm joking when I say Global South with my mouth full. Because we were once known around the planet as poor countries, then as third world countries, then as developing countries, then semi-developed countries. And now we are developing countries. No sir, we are now the economy of the Global South, we want to give ourselves a chance so that the Global South, which has part of what the world needs today, can occupy its place in the economy, in politics and in world culture. Obviously, the BRICS are an exceptional opportunity. We think it is possible to bring other African countries into the BRICS. We think it is possible for other African countries to participate in the G20, but we are just getting started. We are just starting out and, at the G20, in Brazil, one of the things we want to discuss are the financial institutions that have existed since the UN was created, such as the IMF and the World Bank.

Whether these institutions will serve to help finance the development of poor countries or whether they will continue to exist to suffocate poor countries. Africa, I don't have the precise number, but Africa has a debt of around 860 billion dollars. In other words, a debt that is practically unpayable by several countries. Our suggestion is that the funds that lent this money—or the financial institutions—should take into account the need to transform part of this debt into a productive assets so that this money, instead of returning to the institutions that lent it, goes back by building railways, highways, hydroelectric plants, thermoelectric plants, that is, something that means the development of the continent, that goes back to education, to a university, a research institute.

If we don't change… this will be a big discussion that we want to have at the G20. People need to know that we really want to discuss the functioning of financial institutions, and I am very comfortable saying this because, when I became President of Brazil, you are all very young, but you remember the shame we went through when, every year, two technicians from the IMF came down to inspect Brazilian accounting. Every year.

In other words, a country that was the 12th largest economy in the world receives two inspectors every year to find out whether we were doing things right or not. So you know that, when I arrived, we owed 30 billion to the IMF, we didn't have the money to pay for our exports. We resolved this in just three years. We paid the bill to the IMF, we increased Brazil's credibility with financial institutions, which is a discussion we have to have. These evaluation agencies, we need to create an agency to carry out the agency and to carry out the evaluation of these evaluation agencies, to see how they evaluate countries, to see what their credibility is, how serious they are in the evaluation they make of countries, or who they are serving, when they make a certain negative assessment.

So, thanks to this, you remember that in 2005 China (India) reached, for the first time, a reserve of 100 billion dollars. And when I saw that China (and India) had made a reserve of 100 billion dollars, I was thinking: “The day Brazil manages to make a reserve of 100 billion dollars we will be very, very, very well placed in the picture.” We ended up making 370 billion dollars in reserves. Brazil became the fourth international reserve in the world.

This allows Brazil to be as Brazil is today. A country that, even if it was ungoverned, as it was in the last four years, even ungoverned, abandoned, the country had support, because it had a cushion that gave security to those who still wanted to believe in investing in Brazil.

So we want to discuss this at the G20. Let's invite the most important economists in the world to have this discussion, because we need it. Furthermore, we want to discuss the functioning of the United Nations, because as it stands today, the UN effectively no longer represents the reasons why it was created, that is, it cannot solve any problems, and the members of the Security Council are the largest weapon producers, those who have nuclear weapons, m who have the right to veto—and they are the very ones who do not comply with anything from the Security Council, they do not submit to the Security Council. So if we don't take advantage of this historic moment and discuss these issues, we will never discuss them.

In other words, I have been telling my fellow presidents, who I have been talking to, that we do not have to wait for the goodwill of someone who is currently a member of the Security Council to understand that it is time for us to enter the Security Council. Whoever is there doesn't want anyone else to enter. In other words, we are the ones who have to fight to get in, and want to build a new world geography based on local reality. Geopolitics is different from in 1945, in 1948, in 1950.

The world is different, so we need to ensure that there is more robust representation from more countries.

That's why we are defending that there could be three countries from Africa, two from Latin America, India, Germany, Japan. We need to add more people and end the right of veto in the UN, because it is unacceptable that a country alone may veto the approval of something that was approved by all members.

So we are building a new world, you remember that in 2003 we said that another world was possible, another Brazil was possible. I believe that it is possible to build another world. Africa is a part of the world that can grow a lot. Rich countries need to believe in investment, which they have to make on the African continent.

And Brazil wants to humbly bring to Africa something that we can bring: the experience of the success of Brazilian agriculture, and not just of Brazilian agribusiness. When we talk about Brazilian agribusiness, we have to remember that Brazil has 4 million and 600 thousand properties with less than 100 hectares of land, which are responsible for producing almost 80% of the things we consume. And it is high quality agriculture.

So we can bring all of this. We approved our Mais Alimentos program. We are going to see if we can extend the Mais Alimentos program to Africa, to Latin America, that is, so that poor countries can buy agricultural machinery and implements cheaper, with longer financing, so that we can increase the agricultural production of small and medium-sized producers.

So that's it.

And I think that, every time I come to Africa, every time I talk to an African president... I was talking to the president of Nigeria... I don't know if you know, at the end of the 16th century, there were 10 thousand Brazilian citizens living in the city of Lagos. Ten thousand Brazilians. There is a street named after something from Brazil. Brazil moved away from Nigeria. In other words, 10 billion in trade fell to 1.7 billion. 180 billion inhabitants there, 200 in Brazil. And there is no flight between Lagos and São Paulo. So we're going to have to discuss our geopolitics in Brazil internally and in Africa, so that we don't end up depending on someone who, to go to Nigeria, go to Europe and then go down to Nigeria, doesn't make any sense.

Ethiopia has a flight to Brazil, but Brazil does not have a flight to Ethiopia. It's senseless, because the one that should have the most interest was exactly the country that may have more industry, more technology, you know, but unfortunately our country still has a very elitist way of thinking, very subordinated to European culture and the United States—and it doesn’t think about the world. We want to think, to open this world so that everyone can participate. That’s it.

Question from a journalist — Good afternoon, Mr President. I'm Américo Martins from CNN Brasil. I wanted to ask an international politics question. The main topic currently being discussed globally is the death of Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny in a prison in the Arctic Circle in Russia. This death is being heavily criticized by many governments, because it is very suspicious due, obviously, to the human rights record, to the disrespect for human rights and authoritarianism of President Putin's government. I would like to know why the Brazilian government has not commented on this death until now, and whether you think it could be a suspicious death or not.

President Lula — I think it's a matter of common sense. You just said it. In other words, if the death is under suspicion, we must first carry out an investigation to find out why this person died. Let's believe that the coroners will say “the person died from this, that” so you can make a pre-judgment. Because, if not, you judge now that it was I don't know who ordered the murder and it wasn't and then you will have to apologize. Why this hurry to accuse someone? Do you know how many years I've been waiting to find out who is behind Marielle's death? Six. And I'm not in a rush to say who it was, but I want to find it. When I find out I will say: “it was so and so.” I don't want speculation.

So he died in prison, I don't know if he was sick, if he had any problems, like when a citizen died on the plane that came to Ethiopia to bring the Brazilian delegation. You know, a boy died inside the plane. Who are we going to blame? You have to do the forensic examination later so you can know the following: “Look, this guy had something like this and died.” Because, if not, it's trivializing an accusation. I even understand the interests of those who immediately accuse: “it was so and so.” It's not my motto. I hope that the coroner here will do the examination and say what this person died of. That's it.

Question from a journalist — Good morning, president, how are you? Renato, from Folha de São Paulo. President, I need to ask about the prisoner escape from Mossoró. I just wanted to know your assessment and whether you consider there were errors and by whom.

President Lula — I didn't want to answer about Brazil, but I will. First, the first person who said that he would be carrying out an investigation to find out whether there was participation by someone who worked at the maximum security prison was Minister Lewandowski. That said, we are looking for the prisoners, we hope to find them and, obviously, we want to know how these men dug a hole and no one saw it. All they had to do was to hire an excavator. I don't want to accuse, but theoretically it seems like there was collusion with someone in the system inside.

I can't accuse anyone. I am forced to believe that an investigation being carried out by the local police and the Federal Police will tell us tomorrow or the day after tomorrow what happened in the Mossoró building. We have been building these prisons since 2005, this is the first time that people have escaped from a prison. This means there may have been certain negligence, and we will know by whom. That’s all.

Journalist's question — Mr President, Lúcia Müzell, of Rádio França Internacional for Brazil. In Egypt, you promised new aid for the Palestinian refugee agency in Gaza. We would like to know how much this aid will be, when it will occur, and also what Brazil's goal is in announcing this measure in a context in which several countries are suspending aid due to suspected connections between agency officials and Hamas. You even criticized this suspension in Egypt. In a context that I would also like to perhaps relate to the context of Venezuela, in which the Venezuelan human rights agency, the UN in Venezuela, employees are being expelled from there, 72 hours for them to leave. I would like to know if you comment on this too.

President Lula — I don't have any information about what's happening in Venezuela, about Venezuela's fight with the UN. I can answer this question precisely when I get back to Brazil, and have a meeting with Brazilian foreign policy and find out. But look, it's really funny! It's very funny. When I see the rich world announce that it is stopping its contributions to the humanitarian issue for the Palestinians, I wonder how much political awareness do these people have? And how big is the heart of solidarity of these people who cannot see that, in Gaza, it is not a war that’s happening, but a genocide! It's not a war between soldiers and soldiers. It is a war between a highly prepared army and women and children.

Look, if there was a mistake in this institution that collects money, punish those who made the mistake, but don't suspend humanitarian aid for a people who have been trying to build their State for decades. Brazil not only stated that it will contribute—I cannot say how much because it is not the president who decides, it is necessary to see who takes care of this in the government, to know how much it will contribute—but said it will defend in UN the definition of the Palestinian State to be definitively recognized as a full and sovereign State.

It is important to remember that, in 2010, Brazil was the first country to recognize the Palestinian State. I need to stop being small when we have to be big. What is happening in Gaza with the Palestinian people does not exist at any other historical moment. In fact, it existed when Hitler decided to kill the Jews. So there will no longer be any humanitarian aid. Who will help build those houses that were destroyed? Who will restore the lives of 30 thousand people who have already died? 70 thousand who are injured? Who will restore the lives of children who died, without knowing why they were dying? Is this enough to disturb the humanitarian sense of the planet's political leaders?

So, honestly, either political leaders change their behavior towards human beings, or human beings will end up changing the political class. What is happening in the world today is a lack of deliberation. We have no governance! I say it every day: the invasion of Iraq did not go through the UN Security Council. The invasion of Libya did go through the UN Security Council. The invasion of Ukraine did not go through the UN Security Council. And the massacre in Gaza did not go through the UN Security Council.

In fact, the decisions taken by the Council were not carried out, and neither was the criminal decision taken now in the South African case. What are we waiting for to humanize human beings? This is what is missing in the world. Brazil remains in solidarity with the Palestinian people. Brazil condemned Hamas, but Brazil cannot fail to condemn what the Israeli Army is doing in Gaza.

Friends, have a good trip.